I've got a confession to make.
I need to get this off my chest.
As a business owner, we all make mistakes.
I've gotta confess, I've gotta confess.
Hey guys it's Charley
from Confessions of a Business Owner once again
and today I have a very special guest
Ilana Wechsler from Green Arrow Digital
who has come on to confess what I can only describe
as a fantastic story I'm really looking forward
to this one today.
I did get a little bit of a preview,
so I know what's coming
but I really think there's many many people
that will have done similar things out there
and it's time to bring that to the open.
So Ilana how are you doing?
- I'm well, thanks Charley, how are you?
- I'm really well, thank you so much for being on the show.
- It's a pleasure to be here.
- Now I'll quickly read out some bio things here.
So Ilana is a CEO and founder of Green Arrow Digital
a PPC agency, she's a former data analyst.
Which I was saying is like the perfect
career to come into the PPC world,
there's a lot of data analyst type activities that go on.
She has a husband and three lovely young children
and is based in Sydney.
And she also like to, as well as doing
a done-for-you service she has her own community
in which she teaches people how to do PPC,
so passing on the skill sets.
Which I think is very very cool.
- Thank you.
- So how are you doing in Sydney this fine morning?
How's business in general?
- Business is good, business is busy as you know,
you're a fellow PPC person.
You know that PPC fun just never stops.
- Well the irony is that I look at this
and I find that the people that are good at PPC
are always super busy
and should always have a really good amount of leads
coming into their business and if they don't,
it's an integrity issue.
It's a really big integrity issue.
- It's true, I think there's a lot of sharks out there
so if you are good at what you do
and you have good integrity and good business ethic
then it doesn't take long for word to get out
and true story, I've never actually done PPC
for my own agency, so I've never had to,
which is, I guess a testament to hopefully,
what I think good work ethic
and good quality service for people.
- It certainly does and I can even look back
on my time in my PPC agency,
even though it was many many years ago now,
we had much of the same thing.
I can't remember us ever running ads in that nature.
And alarmingly, I think that a good 20% of the leads
that came into our business were actually
other marketing agencies.
And I was always curious.
I was very curious about that.
Do you notice the same?
Do you get other marketing agencies coming to you?
- Yeah, we used to go down the white labeling route
for a while, so therefore other agencies white labeling us
because many full service agencies don't really
wanna do the PPC work.
It's very fiddly work, it's hard to scale,
it's hard to recruit for, so they were using us.
We kinda do that less and less actually.
We found there were some issues, just lack of client
communication and et cetera like that.
So I tend to not like to do that anymore.
But yeah, I can relate, marketing agencies contacting us.
- Ooo that saga continues.
Good to know it wasn't just us.
- No.
- Now I wanna get into it, 'cause this is just
such a good story.
I got a bit excited when you mentioned it early
from today, so I'm gonna get straight into it.
It's your time to come on and confess on the show.
Do you wanna take us through this story?
I'm eager to hear in detail.
- All right, putting myself out there.
Okay, so it needs a bit of context
so rather than going straight for the confession
I'm kinda gonna lead into it a little bit
in that I'm not your kinda classic story
of I wanted to become,
open a digital agency by any means.
So as you said with my bio, I did used to be a data analyst,
I was for about 10 years working for lots of corporate
companies and when I had a family basically
the decision was kinda made up for me
to leave my job even though I loved it actually.
And had every intention to return,
but family life got in the way and corporate
and family are like oil and water,
they don't mix basically.
So I thought, what am I gonna do?
You know, what are my skills?
And my skills were very much Excel.
I spent 10 years basically building Excel spreadsheets.
So I thought I might try and do that.
So I started like an Excel consulting
and I got some traction and I built a website
'cause I put an add on Gumtree and was getting leads
that way and so I built a website called Excel Help
and low and behold, no one came to my website.
So that kinda sparked the journey of online marketing
and I tried affiliate marketing,
and for probably a year, I think, failed miserably at that.
I thought, okay, scrap that, what else can I do?
So I tried building content sites and monetizing via
AdSense and I actually built that up to be quite decent.
And I had a team of writers and I had a bunch of websites,
and then of course the algorithm update happened
and my business was a house of cards
and came crashing literally overnight.
So I thought, what are my skillsets?
My skills are data and knowing about keyword research
and AdSense, I kind of what somewhat exposed
to AdWords 'cause it's the other side of the equation.
And so I thought, I'm gonna do, I'm gonna do PPC work.
Can't believe I didn't think of this earlier.
This is my home.
So, I did a whole bunch of courses.
I bought a stack of books that I had on my desk
and I was working through all the content.
But you and I know, at the end of the day
you need an account to really work on
and play with, and I thought, what am I gonna do?
Like I didn't wanna do the Excel work,
so I needed some kind of client account
to really learn, 'cause only through implementing
do you actually learn.
And everyone says to learn on your own account first,
but I had nothing to promote, I had nothing.
So I thought, I don't know what to do.
And a dear friend of mine who will remain nameless
because to protect the integrity of him,
said to me that he, well he had a marketing agency,
and his PPC person had let him down
and so he was looking for someone to give that account to
to manage and he gave me my first account.
So I was a PPC expert without ever actually
having played in a real live account that was running.
So that is my confession.
But I knew that I had a really strong work ethic,
and I knew that I understood the concepts very well,
and I wasn't completely green to online.
So I thought, I just know I can make this work.
And fast forward over five years they are actually
still a client which is pretty amazing.
- That is such a good story.
There's a bit of a fake it till you make it moment there
where it's getting that first client before we're in there.
But sometimes that can be what it takes in business.
I think it's a very very cool thing.
- Thank you, yeah, look, I mean that first month
that I had that account I probably spent
a obscene amount of time in that account.
Much more than I would have to now.
But I was so petrified about making a mistake
and I would cross reference what was in the account
with what was in the books,
which is in the online video tutorials that I was running.
So I work out my hourly rate from the income
I made from that first account, obviously it was not
about that, it was about me learning, but yeah,
that's really where I honed my skills.
- Well what a learning experience none-the-less.
And for anyone that's not in the PPC space
or has done similar things, I kind of think
that marketing in general, it's kind of like riding a bike.
And what I mean by that is there's only so many
books you can read on riding a bike.
Or only so many courses you could take on riding a bike.
At some point you've gotta ride a bike.
It's never gonna-- - That's right.
- Be the same.
It's the experience that develops the skill.
So I think that's very cool.
But how did you find that first month
and that learning experience?
Because I can only imagine it probably put some
pressure on you.
- Yeah, look, absolutely.
I think the difference was it was a very well established
account so I was walking in on something
that was very, like it was built already.
I mean, in hindsight it was a complete mess
and I actually ended up completely rebuilding it
because it just defied what was taught to me.
And I was taught the right way, so,
but then of course, doubt kinda comes in,
you think, well this is what previous person did
and I just took a punt and I just thought no.
I'm gonna go with what I think
and I had legitimate I guess reasoning behind that thinking
and I guess I just backed myself.
With a lot of learning, you know, I wasn't completely
blind with it, but yeah that first month
was really hard and I was under a lot of pressure.
But, I mean, as I said, like I hardly charged this client
anything, it was really just to recover some of my time.
But I, you know, obviously have raised my prices
since then now that I've got more experience.
But, yeah, it was just, it was just to learn.
- Did you ever disclose to the client
that it was your first account?
Did they know?
- Sorry the audio just got distorted for a sec.
- It's all good then, we'll just go for the question again.
Did you ever disclose that to the client?
Did they ever know about it?
- No, and even though they're still a client
I've never actually met them because it's still through
this other agency.
- Oh wow, that is so brilliant on many many levels.
And to have them five years later still,
and still be performing for them I think is,
makes the story even better.
'Cause you've worked through all the learning stages
and kept them on board.
- And I think what was lucky was this account
was in a really weird niche.
So it wasn't a very expensive niche
where we were dealing with hight cost per clicks
like law firms or whatever where if you make a mistake
you will be creamed.
This was in an industry which obviously I can't reveal,
but it's quite obscure and the cost per clicks
were about a dollar and still are.
So, it was kind of, in an industry where there was a lot,
not a heap of competition, and the implications
for making a mistake weren't so great.
- Good to know.
Now when you look back over this experience now,
is there anything you would do differently?
- (inhaling deeply) Anything I would do differently,
Um, that's a good question.
Probably lots.
What would I do differently?
You've stumped me.
I know that there are lots of things I would do differently,
but early on I specialized in PPC thinking
that that's probably the wrong decision,
but in hindsight that ended up being the right decision
and I specialized just because that's
what I really love to do.
And so I guess, that's what I would recommend
for some people.
What would I, what would I say,
What was the question again?
- If you could go back and have this experience
over again, would you do anything differently?
- I'd probably hire people a lot quicker,
because I got busy very very quickly.
I would, um,
yeah I don't know.
I would probably have chosen to do this a lot sooner,
because I wouldn't have kind of followed
the bright shiny object of going after affiliate marketing
'cause that was all the rage then,
and then SEO which was my AdSense sites.
I would have probably really looked at my skillsets
and thought what's a good fit?
But when you don't know what PPC is you don't know.
You can't find a way, you know?
Um yeah, so-- - Well I think we've all
dabbled in SEO at some point and have deep regrets
about that. - Yes, it's true.
(Charley laughing)
- It comes with it.
So, looking at this experience and you've had a moment
where you've taken on account without necessarily being
experienced, but backed yourself well
and pulled it off, - Yeah.
- For anyone that's thinking about getting into PPC
or perhaps starting a digital marketing agency,
is this an approach you would say is worth doing?
Or was it way too stressful and not advisable?
- I'd say it's probably not advisable.
And there's a reason lots of people say try
on your own account first.
And I would also agree with that.
Like, I just was stumped to think of what I can
experiment on that I just thought,
I would love to try on my own account,
but I just couldn't think of what I could do or use.
So, in that respect, hopefully somebody who's looking
to get into PPC kind of can, can find a way
to kinda test, maybe test it with affiliate products
and stuff like that.
So, yeah, I'd say going down that route is probably
not for everyone, but I just thought, I could do this.
And I had, I don't know, blind faith
that in my skills that I thought I could do it.
But probably in hindsight, I wouldn't really recommend
anyone else to do that.
Hence why it's a confession, 'cause it's something
that I don't think people should do.
- I actually will agree with that in a way.
I think if you can find particularly a friend
or family member maybe you know another business owner
that would let you have a play,
can be a really good starting point.
Or your own stuff, if you do have availability.
It is, especially like these days,
I can see how expensive PPC is getting
or those types of fields.
Melting a credit card is very very possible these days.
Which is just a word of caution
for anyone looking to play in this space.
But I wanna shift it up a little bit here now.
I wanna talk more about the PPC industry
because I was going through your podcast earlier
this morning and listened to one of your updates.
And I think there's many many things happening,
so I wanna kinda get your context
on a couple of things here and the first one is,
do you think the average business owner
can do their own PPC these days
or do they need to hire an expert?
- I do genuinely believe that they can,
and in a limited capacity, yes, but and in the right kind
of business yes, but as soon as you really,
like a local business for example,
like a local dental practice.
I have a lot of dental clients.
I do believe it's pretty vanilla.
Like it's pretty much a mobile campaign,
there are probably five to 10 keywords
that will end up being profitable.
And I think you could totally, with some learning,
I would say, definitely don't do it yourself
without educating yourself somewhat.
But often it is, I think you can learn it.
But provided you have someone in house,
either an admin assistant or somebody who is skilled
in this area to learn a couple of the strategies,
I think yeah you can.
I do, I do believe that.
And I know that because in my training community
we have people like that who have taken
the time to learn, we've actually helped them.
We've built the account for them with the right structure
and negative keywords and match types et cetera.
We've showed them how to optimize it ongoing.
And they're doing well.
- I tend to agree on that one as well.
I think there's, obviously it's not a one size fits all.
Some industries need a pro, and some maybe not so much so.
But if you're in that category where you
could possibly do it yourself,
what type of time commitment does someone need to say?
Is this like you need to have a couple of hours a week
to put into your account?
Is that enough or more?
- I think a couple of hours a week is probably enough
once it's humming along nicely.
And that's the thing.
Like we know certain industries really really well,
where as I said, we will build the account for them,
knowing generally what will work and what don't work.
And once it is, as I said, humming along nicely,
I think it's probably like an hour or two a week.
Showing people a handful of things of what you're gonna do,
what you're gonna monitor ongoing.
And like they're not having complicated remarketing funnels.
They're not gonna be doing display ads,
they're not gonna doing Gmail ads
and all these kind of like funky, fancy stuff
that's new and really it's not going to doing YouTube ads.
So I think getting an agency for a lot of kind of local
kind of businesses is overkill.
I mean some businesses just don't want to have
anything to do with it, and they're willing
to pay that premium to get an agency
and there's always those businesses like that.
But other people where they are on tight budget,
and AdWords is expensive.
You know, for a dental care, you're looking at around
$10 a click, so those costs add up pretty quickly
for the actual ads.
I don't know, I'm a believer in why not just spend
all your budget on the ads rather than the agency?
- Ooo, I think there's a lot of agencies
that are listening to this podcast right now
sorta throwing kicks at the wall and hands in the air.
- That's not to say like there's not a place
for the agency.
I'm not saying that, as I said.
Just for many local kind of businesses, personally,
I think it can be overkill.
- Wah, I'm a fence sitter.
I see both sides of it, which I think is really interesting
but the analogy I like to use,
which I think anyone who's not in the marketing industry
may be helpful is I kinda think of it like cooking, right?
It's kind of like, if you just need meat and three veg,
getting a personal chef could be overkill.
So if you're just that little simple thing,
on the reverse, if you're trying to produce
some sort of really high end filet mignon truffle concoction
with handmade pasta from Italy,
or something like that which is really really
starting to get complex, then getting that chef in
can save you a lot of pain and frustration.
So that's the way I kinda like to think about it.
Would you agree with that?
- 100% and that's my point.
Like a plumber's not gonna do a complicated remarketing
funnel, they're just trying to get the phone to ring
for someone's leaking pipes, for example.
So yeah, so that's the meat and two veg.
And getting the chef is overkill.
So that's that balance that I totally agree with you.
And I think it's an excellent analogy.
- That was funny 'cause I know my mom
will probably listen to this episode
and she'll call me and go, what's PPC?
So I always like to include a little note for her
so she can see what's happening.
And thank you mom for listening to the show,
it's how we get our downloads and opt-ins so cheers.
But I'll shift it up from here and I think we might do
one each on this one, because I have an opinion
on this one as well, but what is the most common mistake
you see in PPC or marketing these days?
- Oh man, where do I start?
They don't, PPC being AdWords or you mean Facebook as well?
- You can go broadly here, can be marketing,
can be any of it.
And I'll let you pick your favorite.
- Okay, so if I'm going to kinda cover the big picture
on both, I'd say they kind of doing have a clear strategy
of what they're gonna do.
They just wanna generate leads
and let's say once they generate leads
through some kind of lead magnet or free guide or something,
they've got no method of converting those leads into sales.
That's kind of, or just like some kind of big picture
strategy of how they're going to get people
into their ecosystem and to be able to generate
a return on investment.
That's kind of the biggest mistake I've seen people make.
From an AdWords point of view they,
they, lots of mistakes, they try and do it themselves
and they don't educate themselves and there's lots
of like Google landmines that are placed
designed to make Google more money
and this business spend more money.
So if you are gonna do it yourself,
you need to educate yourself of these little landmines
that are placed around.
And yeah, but I think big picture,
they kind of lack a conversion strategy.
What about you? What do you think?
- I think that's a really good answer
you've just described there.
I would agree on both of them.
For me, the thing I see over and over again,
and over and over and it will continue to happen
even after I say this, I think the biggest mistake
people make with their marketing,
in particular PPC campaigns, is they don't talk
to a customer where they're at.
They talk from where they are at.
- Yep.
- So the example I use of this is like,
we as business owners know our product really really well,
but the consumers don't.
So we see a lot of PPC ads where it's like they're talking
really about the thing and from a level of awareness
that's like way up where we are,
instead of seeing where the customer's at
and their customers' understanding of it.
So I'll use AdWords as the example here
'cause I think this will kind of clear up the context.
I see PPC agencies put up ads where they'll
talk about the specifics of like, oh the new Gmail ad
feature to get your CTR out 14%, and they'll target that
towards, let's say your dentist mates
we've been talking about earlier.
And the dentist's just got no idea
about CTR is or Gmail ads, that's not in their awareness.
But if the AdWords ad had say, hey, I can get you
more customers in the door.
I can get more dental patients in your dental clinic,
that's what they're really interested in.
That might actually be the same thing.
But how they're communicating it is just different levels,
just way out of sync.
- It's interesting, I've been guilty
of that myself actually.
Because being an inherently technical person,
when I discovered AdWords I got so excited,
it actually blew my mind that you could do this stuff.
And it just like was so genius.
I got so excited, and I thought oh my god,
I can help so many people.
It's gonna be awesome.
So I tried to get, you know, grow my agency, you know?
And I fell into exactly that trap.
I was like, you can do this, and you get click through rate,
and this conversion rate, and like, I was talking
another language to people.
And I just, I was like that, it didn't even,
I couldn't communicate with people.
So, I can relate to that, and actually what I did was,
I did, I went to business networking breakfasts
for about a year, just to learn how to communicate
with business owners and talk the language
and understand what actually was interesting to them
and what they wanted to know.
And as soon as someone said, oh that's interesting,
tell me more, I thought okay, now I'm communicating
in such a way that it makes sense to them,
because yeah, I was guilty of that.
Another confession!
- We made two on the show here, this is great.
(Ilana laughing)
What a great strategy for improving it though.
I think that's a really great way of going about it.
It's like well hang on, I'm gonna go hang out
where my audience is or where business owners are.
And instead of, I suppose hiding and trying to work
behind a computer, speaking to real people
and communicating at that level and seeing indicators
of when people show interest,
I think is a fantastic strategy for this.
- It was good.
And I guess what was also good was that none of the people
in the room were my target audience.
Like they didn't really have much marketing budget,
and that's what I loved about it,
because it was actually a safe environment.
Because I didn't want any of them to be my clients.
I wasn't trying to sell to these people,
they were just kind of like my guinea pigs, you know?
And so that when I was talking to the right business
I could, I knew what to say to people,
and I could talk in a language that was relevant to them
and kind of talk about, find out what their ultimate
goals were et cetera, but yeah, no more technical talk.
- Yeah, and I think that's another great way
of talking about it is that you're going,
we do speak another language.
We really do, we just don't necessarily
perceive it that way.
And this is across so many niches.
This isn't just marketing, like this is mechanics,
this is dentists. - Absolutely.
- This is people who do websites,
there's tons of it out there that applies.
- And it applies to copywriting actually.
It's kind of, it's not words,
just words on the page, you know?
- Absolutely.
So the next one I wanna ask you,
and I think you'll be, have your finger
on the pulse more than I do in this one
is like what do you see as the best PPC strategies
of today or what's working the most
from your perspective?
- Oh god, it really depends on the industry.
You know there's a lot of noise in the industry,
there's a lot of latest and greatest and newest strategies,
there's Facebook Messenger and bots
and all this fancy, fancy stuff.
But, to be honest, we still do a lot of the fundamentals,
just the classic kind of lead magnet promotions
with on the thank you page we will then have some kind
of offer or move people along.
But in terms of the best PPC strategy,
I think it really depends on the industry that you're in.
I do think that in this day and age
it is very multi platform and multi device.
And we see this all the time where we might be
promoting something on Facebook that we've just
kicked it off on Facebook but then we,
'cause we're doing remarketing for search on AdWords
we'll see people searching for the specific thing
that we were advertising on Facebook where
that was the only way that they could
have found out about it.
So we are literally seeing, people will see an ad
on Facebook, but then they're Google searching it.
- So that's really interesting.
The cross platform I've noticed in my own stuff
is becoming bigger and bigger.
- It is.
- The layman term of that, that what we're kind
of referring to here is that Facebook and Google
and even things like LinkedIn or SEO
are working more and more together
and less and less individually.
- Absolutely.
So I'm a big believer in the big picture
and the holistic kind of, especially from a remarketing
point of view, you've got to take a holistic approach.
I mean, being the data analyst person that I am obviously,
I wanna go into the minutia of how each platform
is performing, but there is a gray area
where you can't really quantify which specific platform
contributed x dollars because of that cross promotion.
And I think each, you've kind of gotta look at it
in a big picture sense and how much did we put
in the big picture for our online marketing,
and did that contribute to the overall growth
of the business?
Because people behave differently online.
What you do online and how I behave online
are very different.
So you need to factor that in for people.
- Absolutely, I find I have biases.
Like me personally, I don't,
and I shouldn't really say this on air, but I will.
It's like I don't check my email.
I don't do it, like my VA manages my email.
And then dictates or tells me things like that.
- That's interesting. - So for me like
I have a bias not
to think email's effective, because I don't use it.
Like it's not, I do go in there occasionally
I will say, but overall, it's not somewhere
where I'm spending a lot of the time.
But I speak to other people and like they're
in the inbox constantly and then they're always
wanting to do more auto responder campaigns,
they're always wanting to do more Gmail ads,
because they see that as where their attention is.
- That's right.
- Play a huge role in how we all behave differently online.
- That's right and I think that's why as a business
you need to cater for those differences in behavior.
As I said, we see it all the time where,
and it's even multi device, ya know?
People might be standing at the bus stop
waiting for the bus and they're on their Facebook news feed,
scrolling through, they get to work
and then they Google search it.
- Because-- - I do that!
- Right, there ya go.
And that happens all the time.
I just think, and Google have done studies on this
where mobile internet usage and mobile internet search
has actually surpassed desktop.
And I think that's just because ya know,
people have their phone next to them in bed
and that's the last thing they look at
when they go to sleep and the first thing they look at
when they wake up in the morning.
So as a business you've gotta kind of understand
that big picture point of view.
- Definitely, I agree with that on a big level.
So, on the basis of that, and when we kind of look
at it from there, who are the business owners
you look up to or aspire to be more like based on that?
- The business owners? What do you mean?
- So who are the business owners you think are doing this
really really well, the multi device
and the multi marketing thing?
Is there clients of yours?
Is there other businesses you watch in this space
you think are doing this well?
- That's a good question.
I think the people who are really good at content
marketing and amplifying that content
I think are really good.
And there's lots of people that fall
into kind of that category, like this whole content,
this whole concept of like create the content
and people will find it, I think is a bit of a farce.
Absolutely you need to create content,
but you need to amplify it through
often paid traffic mechanisms.
So, who's a good example of that?
- Do you know who's a good example?
- Please. - Me.
- Okay.
- We actually, we noticed when,
and this is really interesting,
so for anyone interesting to the podcast now,
it's like for the podcast itself,
every episode we publish we also amplify with paid ads.
- Right.
- Because in the beginning it was like
we're not really sure how to get this out there,
but promoting on Facebook, YouTube,
I think we even do a little bit of Instagram,
I have to check with the team,
but we noticed a massive rift in promoting content.
Like there's a fantastic way to grow the podcast.
- Yes.
Where do you send the traffic to?
- So we've begun putting the video uploaded
into the platform, so we upload this video
like what you're on right now will be uploaded
into Facebook and YouTube and then we promote
that actually video file with a link back
to the website or if there's any,
- To the website.
- Downloads or something like that, we route in that way.
- I think that's a good strategy because I've been,
lots of people have asked me about this
and they wanted to send the traffic to iTunes,
to their actually specific podcast episode on iTunes,
and I'm like no, don't do that.
- If you're on the audio right now
and you can't see it, I'm like cringing a little bit,
'cause that's oh, there's no tracking, it scares me.
- Totally!
And no opportunity to remarket to these people.
I mean, it's such a missed opportunity.
So yeah that's great that you're doing that.
- I'm thrilled to know I'm on track.
- Yeah, tick!
- I thought my PPC skills might be a little bit rusty,
but I still got it baby.
- It's like riding a bike, as you say.
- Oh well, that's really awesome from there.
So who were the people you learned these PPC strategies off?
Is it a lot of self discovery
or do you have mentors or people you follow
in the PPC space?
- Yeah, look, I am always learning with this stuff.
That's the thing like I think the PPC industry
is changing so much that I'm by no means gonna rest
on my laurels and think there's nothing more
left for me to learn.
By no means do I do that.
I was recently in trafficking conversions actually,
in San Diego, learning from Ezra Firestone for example.
He does a lot of, he does a lot of Messenger
for his e-commerce stuff Facebook Messenger stuff.
Mike Rhodes, he does a lot of AdWords stuff.
Heaps of people.
I've read a lot of blogs, a lot of experimentation
that my clients fortunately give me permission to do.
I say full disclosure, we are testing this.
As with a lot of the AI push that Google is doing
towards machine learning and artificial intelligence
and smart bidding, they're willing to trust me,
which I'm grateful for to experiment.
And full disclosure I say this is a test,
we're gonna give it a small amount of budget,
but at the end of the day you've gotta test this stuff
so I learn from heaps of people, yeah.
- Brilliant and big shout out to Mike Rhodes.
Believe or not, Mike's the guy who taught me AdWords
many many many years ago.
- Mike is great, yeah.
- Phenomenal human.
- Yes.
- I'm actually gonna send him the link to this podcast
after this so he can see he's still getting a plug.
- Hopefully he's blushing.
- You'd think, I mean the people on this podcast
are pretty high level, and for us to be
boasting about him, he'll get a kick.
- Yeah, nice.
- Okay, so I suppose the next thing I wanna ask
is there's, being there's so much to learn
in this space, I know you've got a podcast,
which I had a listen to this morning,
which shared a whole bunch of stuff,
I think we should give it a bit of a plug here.
Tell people about the name of your podcast
and where people can find it, because if they wanna
know more about PPC, I think it's a great place
to start or even enhance what you already know.
- Aww, thanks for that.
So my podcast is called Talking Web Marketing
and it really obviously talks about PPC stuff,
'cause that's my home.
But I didn't want to limit it to just PPC,
so we talk about also big picture traffic strategies,
you're gonna be coming on as a guest as well,
so you're gonna talk about your fantastic traffic strategy.
I just became quite obsessed with traffic as a whole.
So we cover lots of sales funnels, that kinda stuff.
So Talking Web Marketing.
- And definitely checked it out.
I listened to a great episode with Greg Kaza,
I always butcher his last name, I hope that was close.
But that was a really good episode I enjoyed.
So for anyone looking for picking the first one,
I think it's a solid start.
Or if my episode's out by then, then of course, pick me.
- Of course.
- It'll be the best. - Yes, totally.
- Okay, so if people wanna learn more about you, Ilana,
where can they go?
Where's the best place to get more info?
Is it the podcast or your website or what's the go?
- Probably the best place is my website
called greenarrowdigital.com, and on there
there are links to the podcast obviously.
We have our podcast episodes on our website.
And that's sort of information about our agency
as well as our training stuff.
- Fantastic and I'll make sure there's some links
in the show notes, so if anyone does wanna go
and have a look through, which they should, hint hint,
then that'll all be on the episode notes
and the description.
But we will wrap it up for this episode.
Wanna say a massive thank you for coming on the show
and confessing a great story of your first account
and the experience that came with it.
And also for sharing your insights on PPC.
It's been super super great to hear more about it.
So massive thank you for being on the show.
That's it from here.
- My pleasure Charley, thank you for having me.
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